The Depths of Durangrar: A Dungeon Crawler...in the dark

Thermal Paper Update
almost 8 years ago – Sat, Feb 04, 2017 at 09:52:50 PM

Hello Backers!

We’ve tested out a few new ideas and made some progress on how to move the monster. First we began with magnets. Black gloves seem like the easiest solution moving forward but we expect that many different players will play as the monster and we’re not sure how to accommodate multiple players and if they would be fine with sharing gloves or if we should provide disposable gloves. Testing with disposable vinyl gloves, it got warm and humid in just about 5 minutes. Lastly, it is still possible to see the gloves depending on where the explorers are sitting if the glove should block one of the explorers' lights.

Instead, magnets seemed to be an effective way at moving the monster without giving away its location. While we haven’t playtested it yet, it’s certainly been effective at moving the monster.

The drawback is that the magnets had initially produced scratches on the thermal paper surface only after a few rounds back and forth. Certainly if the magnet produced these marks after a few cycles back and forth, the paper would wear out quickly after a few games. So we started looking at other solutions. We’ve found out that depending on the purpose of the thermal labels, some are coated with a thin plastic to protect them from abrasion and finger oils while others are not. Once we found a coated thermal paper and tested it, the results were a lot more satisfactory. I'm leaving the two different thermal paper samples out in the light and testing if they breakdown. I've left a finger print on both and you can see the one on the right is already starting to break down quick in some areas being directly exposed to sunlight and finger oils.

I’m still working on the night vision goggles. I hope to have more information for you next week. At this point in time in our schedule planned when the kickstarter launched, we had hoped to have found a solution for the night vision goggles and begin the process of ordering those to send to the manufacturer so they could package it with the game. Unfortunately having missed that milestone, we will not be able to make the May 2017 delivery deadline. As soon as we find a suitable night vision goggle set, we'll update our schedule accordingly to try and give you a more definitive delivery date.

Thank you for your continued support! Please don't hesitate to message us if you have any questions. 

Reviewing Quality
almost 8 years ago – Tue, Jan 03, 2017 at 10:20:16 PM

Hello everyone! It’s been a very busy holiday season. I hope you all had a great holiday and New Year's as well!

We’ve begun the sampling process with our manufacturer. This means we’ve sent over our design files and we’ll be in communication back and forth as they produce the very first copies. These won’t be the final copies but rather a quality check copy.

Speaking of quality, from the replies from the last update, I’ve taken some time to seriously review all the design decisions leading up to this point to make sure that quality was good. I’ve reviewed much of the design I’ve done in the past and realized I’ve made a few compromises along the way that ultimately are unacceptable. One of these things is the color/paper used for the maze tiles. A while ago, I found out that direct thermal paper (the paper used for receipts) has an interesting property in that it appears black under visible light but is white in infrared light. This makes it very easy to see the difference between the board and the maze walls. The drawback is that the receipt paper (at least the one I used) fades quickly over time and is extremely susceptible to oils on our skin. When I got my first prototype maze walls, they were much more glossier than my homemade walls and so were easier to distinguish between the walls. I thought maybe this was enough to see and play. But while this works, I’m realizing now that it’s not acceptable. While decisions on what to do in the game should be hard, playing the game itself should not be a hassle. Below shows the difference between using a printed board maze vs. the thermal paper.

 Another compromise I’ve made is how the monster is moved. While the monster blends in well in the dark, a player’s hand does not. This is a problem I’m still working on but I have a few ideas. I’ve been approaching this problem by trying to find a one solution fits all but what likely will be the best solution is to include a few different solutions rather than just one and everyone can pick and choose which one best fits them at home.

November update - some setbacks, other progress and moving forward
almost 8 years ago – Mon, Nov 28, 2016 at 11:33:33 PM

We’re back from BGG Con! We’re so happy to have met some of you in person and shown you the game and gain some of your feedback as well. We had a great time hearing your thoughts about the game and the night vision goggles as well as things you’d like to see in the future. But right now, we’re super focused on delivering the game. Which brings us to...  

Production update!

The biggest development this month was, unfortunately , a couple of setbacks on the night vision goggles development. We had been considering contracting out the design so we could have a fully designed solution that meets everyone’s expectations (and performs better than the pre-production units we shipped with tester sets.) We knew this was a long shot, and ultimately the quote was much higher than budgeted, so this means we will have to continue in-house development or return to our original plan of buying an existing unit from a 3rd party manufacturer. This leaves us coming up hard on one of our deadlines -- to have the night vision goggles ready to send to the manufacturer -- but we’re not behind schedule yet. I still believe that it’s still possible to hit the original schedule, but we we do face a risk of falling behind if we have any additional setbacks on the goggles.  

A personal update

In other news, I wanted to let you all know that I recently began a new job. This actually happened just at the end of the kickstarter campaign, but it hadn’t occurred to me at the time to share this with you, the backers. At that time, I’d thought it was a personal change that didn’t really factor into the campaign, but I now realize that it does impact the project. What are these impacts? I can’t devote myself full time to development for Depths of Durangrar, which is big, though my weekends and evenings are devoted to getting the game into production. I figured that it'd be a lot of back and forth between myself and the manufacturers and waiting in between but it's more than that. On the plus side, I’m learning a lot about working with design manufacturers (from whom I could buy drop in night vision products) and what risks are there and how to avoid them. Furthermore, the additional income has been very helpful in supporting myself (in addition to giving me some resources if things were to go over budget.) As we stand, I still have every dollar from the kickstarter campaign after paying kickstarter’s fees and paying the artists behind The Depths of Durangrar. In the unfortunate event that delivery is delayed, I hope you will continue to trust my ability to deliver; if anything, the new job will help, as the root cause of many kickstarters to fail to deliver has been running out of funds. So, back to my busy schedule! Thanks again for all of your support and don’t hesitate to be in touch. Just remember - if I don’t get back to you right away it’s because I’m hard at work getting the night vision goggles ready.

Results on in. 3D printing for the win.
about 8 years ago – Thu, Oct 27, 2016 at 01:49:50 PM

Hello everyone!

73% of all surveys sent out and 93% of all responses have been in favor of 3D printing. Thank you! We've gotten a quote from Voodoo manufacturing on mass 3D printing all the character bases. They're a relatively new company but have been in the 3D printing business for quite some time and have had quite a few clients and a great portfolio of interesting projects. The quote is cheaper than injection molding three parts so we're excited to work with them and continue researching the Night Vision goggles.

However, one backer, Brian F, is generously donating his time to try and find an injection mold-able solution made with only two pieces. It's quite a challenge but he's definitely interested in trying out different designs and solutions. Below is a comparison between his proposed design (left) and the current 3D printed solution (right). Currently, Brian's design allows a bit of extra light out so the sides and rear are illuminated so it may reveal the monster sneaking up on the player which is an advantage I'd like to give to the monster but this is only the first design revision. If this design proves cheaper than 3D printing, we'll go forward with that.

Thank you!

Character Light Redesign
about 8 years ago – Tue, Oct 11, 2016 at 12:12:18 AM

Hello Everybody!

We've been talking back and forth with our manufacturer and we've come up with a possible solution that hopefully keeps the original design intention. However, since this solution affects everyone, we wanted to hear your feedback before we give the go ahead.

In the last update, I mentioned the original character design couldn't be made using injection molding, at least not without upping the costs quite a bit.

So the new solution is to 3D print the base of the character while injection molding the character piece. Functionally, the 3D printed base will be identical to if it were injection molded. However, since it does not need any metal mold to be manufactured before hand, it is cheaper than injection molding. (Any costs savings will be invested in the Night Vision goggles so everyone still wins!). The drawback of 3d printing the bases is that it will not be as smooth a surface as if it were injection molded. Since it's just an enclosure for the LED circuit, the appearance isn't a critical feature as it is for the character. Hence why the characters will still be injection molded. 

So our question is, would you be happy with a 3D printed base and a separate character or would you prefer everything be injection molded? 3D printing is a fairly new manufacturing process and has mostly only been used for prototypes but recently, it has been used more for finished products. Injection molding has been the go to process for any finished product that's made in plastic. Below is a picture of the two solutions. On the left is the proposed 3D printed solution, on the right is the current solution (although it too is 3D printed as the injection molding molds have not been made yet)

Here's the survey and we've also sent it to your email to collect your answers so please check your inboxes! We'll be tallying the results next week!

https://jackccg.typeform.com/to/SWQDLc